In this episode of Behind the Prop, Wally Mulhern and Bobby Doss tackle one of aviation’s biggest challenges — decision-making for new private pilots. They explore how real pilot judgment begins after certification, when flying solo without an instructor’s safety net. The discussion covers tools like PAVE, real-world stories of in-flight decisions, and how overreliance on technology can lead to costly mistakes. Wally and Bobby emphasize developing personal minimums, maintaining proficiency, and learning from real incidents to strengthen pilot judgment. This episode is a must-listen for pilots looking to bridge the gap between certification and true command confidence.
In this episode of Behind the Prop, hosts Wally Mulhern and Bobby Doss dive into one of the most important and often overlooked stages of a pilot’s development — the period right after earning a Private Pilot Certificate, when decision-making truly begins. While training provides structure and supervision, real pilot-in-command judgment is built through solo experience, reflection, and continuous learning.
Wally explains that many new pilots complete training with strong technical skills but little real-world decision-making experience. He compares flying to golf — once the fundamentals are learned, consistent, thoughtful application separates good pilots from great ones. Without the safety net of an instructor, new private pilots must learn to evaluate fuel, weather, and personal minimums on their own. Both hosts emphasize that certification is not the finish line but the starting point of lifelong learning.
The conversation covers key tools like the PAVE acronym (Pilot, Aircraft, enVironment, External pressures), which provides a structured way to assess preflight risk. Wally and Bobby also stress the importance of mental rehearsals and “what if” scenario planning to strengthen decision-making during unexpected events. Through real stories — from leaving chocks in place to handling equipment failures — they illustrate how small mistakes can lead to valuable lessons when managed properly.
Technology plays a major role in modern flying, but the hosts caution against overreliance on apps and automation. Errors in systems like ForeFlight can mislead pilots who fail to verify data manually. Proficiency, not just currency, is the foundation of safety. Pilots are urged to set personal minimums, fly regularly with instructors, and stay humble about their skill level, especially after certification.
The episode closes with a powerful reminder: good judgment is learned through experience, reflection, and discipline. Wally and Bobby encourage pilots to embrace real-world flying, learn from others’ incidents, and view every flight as an opportunity to refine decision-making. Their shared vision promotes a culture of continuous learning and safety, helping pilots evolve from newly certified to truly competent and confident aviators.
00:01
Behind the Prop Intro
Clear prop 773 Cherokee number two following. Twin traffic three mile final clear. Touch one Charlie Bravo Raceford in Runway two five. Join four mile final.
00:10
Nick Alan
This is behind the prop with United Flight Systems owner and licensed pilot Bobby Doss and his co host, major airline captain and designated pilot examiner Wally Mulhern. Now let's go behind the prop.
00:26
Bobby Doss
What's up, Wally?
00:27
Wally Mulhern
Hey, Bobby, how are you?
00:29
Bobby Doss
I am fantastic as always this week. A spin on a checkride episode. But it's going to be what happens after the episode. This episode's titled beyond the Checkride Building Real World pilot Judgment. I think it's something that I'm still learning. I'm assuming a veteran like you has got a million examples, but we hear it all the time. The private pilot certificate is truly your certificate to continue your learning. I still have goosebumps most days where I hear things in the hallway about people trying something or wanting to take a. Take a flight when maybe they shouldn't. Wally, how real is it that you're the. You're the guy that's meeting thousands of applicants? What, what is the mindset of a private applicant when they get that piece of paper that's signed for. To. To be signed? What. What is it like?
01:23
Bobby Doss
What do you think they're thinking about?
01:26
Wally Mulhern
I think they're thinking, tomorrow I'm going to start flying instrument approaches. And I find it frustrating, but a lot of the programs are programmed that way. You finish your private. And tomorrow we start instrument training. And there's no real time to use that. That skill. You know, it's like learning a sport. And, and. Okay, let's take golf. You're a golfer. You know, there are many aspects to playing golf. There's putting, there's driving, there's chipping, there's the iron game. And it's like we start on the driving range, hitting a ball with a driver. And we hit it, and we hit it. And then. Maybe that's a bad example. Let's say we start with a putter. We learned how to putt, and we get decent at it. Well, now we're gonna learn how to use the driver. Well, you still gotta, you got.
02:30
Wally Mulhern
Still gotta use that putter because every, you know, unless you hit a hole in one or you hit it with the iron, I, you know, of all the holes of golf you played, Bobby, how many of those holes? What percentage. How have you put it on?
02:46
Bobby Doss
100%. Well, I have chipped in a few times, so we'll say 99.6%.
02:52
Wally Mulhern
Yeah, yeah. So, you know, so we, we go from, you know, you have that 10 hours of solo time in your logbook, maybe 10.1, 10.2. You know, assuming you're at a part 61 school and you know, you got your five hours of solo cross country, you've filled all the boxes. Now you're going to go fly for over 40 hours or, well, 40 hours of instrument time with your instructor sitting in the other seat. But because you're a private pilot, you're going to log it as pilot and command time. And it's really not pilot and command time.
03:33
Wally Mulhern
You know, I, I'll maybe get some feedback from this, but if you, if you have some disagreements, feel free to email me at wally@boortheprop.com and I'd love to talk about it, but come on, we log it as pilot in command time, but you're really not pilot in command.
03:52
Bobby Doss
Yeah, it's a, it's a crazy thought process. But the real decisions, the real judgment begins when you're all alone, you are certified, and it's your turn to be truly the pilot in command. And I think that's the mindset or where we came up with this topic. Right. And we're going to break this episode down into three parts like we always do. Recognizing the decision points is part one. Part two is tools for better decision making. And then part three is going to be learning from real incidents and real stories. And our friend Paul Craig has wrote many books on this stuff. But we're going to talk through some of the good, the bad, and really just what you can learn from. So let's jump right in recognizing decision points. I don't think I had any idea. I'll tell you how my story went.
04:43
Bobby Doss
And I was a hobbyist. I wasn't. I had no idea I'd ever own a flight school. I had no idea I would maybe fly a jet one day. My mindset was family pilot. Get my certificate, take one of my friends or family members up as soon as I got it. So I passed my checkride. I think she was scared to death. But my wife joined me on my first flight, Wally. And we kind of tooled around some of our friends houses over off the Grand Parkway. Probably did some what I thought was steep turns at 3,000ft while they took pictures. Right. I was so afraid to get below 2,000ft because I didn't want to break any rules over Populated areas and stuff. I mean, I really didn't know any of that stuff like I do today.
05:25
Bobby Doss
But we got in a plane, we took off, went out there and we came back and I felt like a professional pilot, man. It was all by myself. No one was there to help me. I made the decisions on the weather. But what about that? That happened to be perfect weather that day. But in a prize package with me, my wife, right? The mindset changes drastically when you're all alone. And I think the big key that I want to talk about is how many decisions do you think private pilots are making prior to that 70th hour, maybe ish when they're going on their own? How many times do you think they really got to the airport and said, this weather is good enough for me to go?
06:08
Wally Mulhern
I don't think very many.
06:11
Bobby Doss
And it's a dichotomy of what we do in this training world, right. I don't know how to blame myself. I own a flight school. I don't know how to blame me. We try to enforce pre flight actions as much as we can. But what do you think some of the things are that our flight instructors are thinking about for us that we aren't thinking about as young student pilots coming to the airport wanting to go fly. No one wants to stay on the ground. So we're going to go hopefully. And I go to my instructor and say, are we going? Are we going? I know today it was like 25 Guston 40 in Houston. I bet every student showed up saying, are we going to be able to go?
06:49
Wally Mulhern
Right.
06:49
Bobby Doss
What are CFI's thinking about that we're not thinking about as student pilots?
06:54
Wally Mulhern
Well, I think as a cfi, would you. For somebody to learn how to make decisions, they have to make decisions. I mean, what a novel concept, right? You know, to be a quarterback, at some point you got to put the person in the game and let them see what they can do. And I think we don't let our students make a lot of the decisions. And I'll give, I think maybe I've given this one this example once, but I got in, hopped in the airplane, outside the airplane, were in a Cherokee, so it had one door. And I was outside the airplane and the applicant was in. He got in the left seat and the chocks, the nose wheel on the airplane was chopped.
07:43
Wally Mulhern
And so I'm waiting for him to come out and get the chalks and he looks at me and he says, you ready to go? I said, yeah, I'M ready. He says, well, come on in. I said, well, I'm thinking to myself, wow, okay, I'll get in. So I get in and he briefs me, and we're getting ready to go. And I'm thinking, well, all right. Well, we'll see what happens. Well, about that time, one of the line guys comes out and starts waving at him at the applicant. And my guy just, he waves back at him and I kind of gave him the, you know, the I don't know what's going on, kind of signed the little on guy. He walked away. A little while later, another guy was walking.
08:27
Wally Mulhern
Another guy and a student were walking out to another airplane, and they walked kind of close to ours and they waved at him and kind of most pointed at the front of the airplane, and my guy just waved back. A little while later, someone drove by in a car. Now, all this is happening in a period of about two minutes. Someone drove by in a car and stopped in front of us and waved at us and was pointing at the front of the airplane. And my applicant said, he said to me, wow, everybody's friendly today. They must know I'm on a check ride. And I just kind of snickered at them a little bit. Well, we started the airplane and he pushed the power up and he looked at me and he said, oh, exletive. Now I know why everybody was waving at me.
09:15
Wally Mulhern
So what do you do? He got out and he pulled the chalks out and went and we completed the checkride. Now, my point is, in a flight training situation, as an instructor, would you have let him go that far? And I think most of you would say no, you wouldn't. You wouldn't. You would have told him, hey, the chalks are still in, and that's fine. I mean, I, I get it. I mean, you're under a time crunch. You got another flight in two hours or whatever. But do you think this guy learned a lot more by embarrassing himself a little bit? I think he did. I think he did. I, I think he came back in and probably as he's sitting around with people telling checkride stories, he's going to be able to say, well, you're never going to get.
10:00
Wally Mulhern
Believe what I did on my checkride, and everybody's going to get a laugh out of it. But he's never going to forget those shocks again. I guarantee he will never forget that.
10:09
Bobby Doss
No question. And I have, I want to say it's less than five days ago where I was pulling out Next to a low wing aircraft. See if I just sat down, chalks are in it and I stop and I, I know they're in a hurry, I know they want to go. I just pulled up and said, hey, just want to let you know your instructor's trying to teach you a lesson and I'm going to save you both a lot of headache. And the instructor gets out and goes and pulls the chalks out. He had no clue, by the way, trust me. And he knows who he is, if he's listening. But I said, I know you were going to teach him a lesson, but I thought I'd save you all about five minutes and a little bit of AV gas.
10:47
Bobby Doss
So I thought I would let you know that those were still in the front tire. Now, in a low wing for cfi, if they're not paying real close attention, they might not have visual. Ease assessment is a lot easier because the wheel's exposed when you're standing there, but that low wing could block you off. And today we had a very similar example. Winds were tough. Stage check, 8 o' clock first thing this morning. I think I heard the instructor ask him maybe 17 times before they left the training area, are you sure you want to go? Pretty windy. You sure you want to go? And they went out there and they burned about 0.7 worth of avgas and didn't get anything accomplished.
11:24
Bobby Doss
I saw him try to help that person make the decision, but ultimately they didn't make the right one and they went and it was just undoable. I think there's a million things, but let's talk about six to 10 of these things, right? I think a CFI during flight training's thinking about fuel reserves. I think they're thinking about the weather well beyond what the local airport is. I think they're thinking about where can we land in this practice area 50 times a minute compared to what the student's thinking, notams airspace restrictions. I mean, how many times do you think flight instructors are pushing the nose down in Houston to not break the Bravo shelves? Wally?
12:04
Wally Mulhern
Yeah, probably a lot.
12:06
Bobby Doss
All the time as students are task saturated, right? And you're going to be by yourself, you're going to have your wife, you're going to have these on your own. And then I think it's things like personal minimums. The CFI has his or hers. You probably aren't even thinking about yours. Your personal minimums. Are you with me? Well, the day after you get that certificate, that can't be your personal minimums. You're going to have to define those yourselves. And then it's kind of currency and proficiency. Right. We might have a certificate in our wallet, Wally, but there's a big gap between being certified and proficient. And I think the CFIs are thinking about that all the time. Not so much is the student, maybe not all of you, but that's our mindset for today's show. What do you think?
12:51
Bobby Doss
How well do you think and you do it? How well do your applicants handle the unexpected?
12:59
Wally Mulhern
Not very well. And, and what's funny, what's really funny is we might take off on a, you know, we start the check rides, usually in the cross country phase. Okay. We're going to go to wherever we're going to. And you know, maybe the scenario that I've been given for the last couple weeks, couple months, we end up going a certain way and we divert to a different airport. Well, they may already plug in that different airport into the gps, so they're already planning on diverting the airport abc. And you know, of course, I see that. Well, guess what? We're going there, going to be at a. We're not going to abc. We're, we're definitely not going to abc. We're going to def. Today. And sometimes they'll tell me, well, I wasn't, I, I, I, I wasn't expecting that. And I'm not, I'm not.
14:08
Wally Mulhern
Well, maybe I'm stupid, but I'm not that stupid to know that when I leave a flight school after a check ride that the applicant is not descended upon by all the flight instructors or other students, you know, the guy, you know, maybe I'm at the same flight school two days in a row, and I'm doing a private today, I'm doing a private tomorrow. If I'm the private who's going tomorrow, I'm gonna find that guy that just took a check ride today and say, what do you have you do? I'm, I'm gonna do that. So I, I know that happens, but, you know, we're probably going to do something different. So, I don't know, maybe don't let your DP know that you have an idea of what you're going to do.
14:50
Bobby Doss
Yeah, I'll let the cat out of the bag. There could be a little bit of a gouge database somewhere in Houston, Texas about what you do or don't do, but I've never seen it, Wally. I've never seen it. Yeah, the Unexpected on a checkride or with your instructor is really simulated and quite often not as, as shocking as something that might happen in real life. And it, the unexpected is not always an engine failure. I think actually it's probably very rare, an engine failure. It's going to be the chalks we're left on. It's going to be. I left the tail tied down. It's going to be. It's not. I took a night flight. I don't have my flashlight.
15:31
Wally Mulhern
There's.
15:32
Bobby Doss
It can be so minuscule but still so critical that to the stage of flight or the stage of the thing that you're doing that you need a piece of equipment or something and it just, it's going to be all you. If you don't have your flashlight, your instructor probably has one. And in the world of what happens after your checkride, it's very different. I challenge all of you out there that are training and whatever phase of training you're in, try to break free of your instructor. Make them an observer, make them a DPE from day one or whatever you're doing. Yes, they're going to teach. Yes, they're going to correct. But tell them to quit touching things. Don't touch it, don't fix it. Let me go as far as you feel comfortable letting me go to make me a better pilot.
16:20
Bobby Doss
The unexpected is very different when you don't have someone to fix it for you.
16:26
Wally Mulhern
Yeah. And here's one for the CFIs. If you've listened to this podcast or if you've taken a check ride with me. You know, one of my passions is electrical failures. And so especially at a Cessna, I will say, okay, this time around, for this landing, we're going to have simulated electrical failure. So it's going to be a no flap approach and landing. Here's another element to an electrical failure. In an electrical failure, you're going to lose the intercom. And I'll ask students, I'll ask Instructors of your 65 hours of flight time, how much of that time has been spent with the headset off trying to talk to your instructor? And I believe, I don't think I've ever had anybody say that they have done that. Never. Zero, nada. That means nobody. And you know, that's a big awakening in an electrical failure.
17:29
Wally Mulhern
Obviously you're going to lose all your radios, everything electric in the airplane, but you're going to lose that intercom. So why not instructors? Why not? Someday when you're out in the Practice area. Why don't we say for the next 10 minutes we're going to take the headsets off and we're just going to communicate to each other this way, just by talking. Because you gotta. I won't say scream, but almost scream. Why not? Also, you know, of course, an electrical, in an electrical failure, you will lose the intercom, you're gonna lose all your radios. But what if you just had a failure of the intercom system? Maybe your radio still work, but the intercom doesn't work. Do we know where that hand mic is? Do we have a hand mic in the airplane? Can we use the hand mic?
18:16
Wally Mulhern
Is it in the seat pocket of the seat next to you? Do you need to plug it in? And this is something that pretty much nobody ever knows. Yeah.
18:28
Bobby Doss
And they would. When it happens the unexpected, they're going to wish they would have had that experience for sure.
18:34
Wally Mulhern
Right, right.
18:35
Bobby Doss
The other recognizing decision point that I think gets. I think we talk about it a lot, I think we try to teach it a lot. But I don't think you get the real chance to experience it until you are a rated pilot and you have the opportunity to make a decision like this is proficiency. I know we've done tons of episodes and tons of talking points about this, but man, the first time it's your time to take your wife and kids or girlfriend or boyfriend or whatever on a trip at night and you haven't flown in, let's call it 89 days, should you. I don't know, I think a lot of people think it's no big deal, but man, there's some tricks that your eyes will play. There is some skills. I mean, do you have to be an instrument rated pilot?
19:27
Bobby Doss
Not in Houston. It's too bright here. But if you're not in Houston, it might be tough to fly at night. If you don't have a lot of land lights, you don't have a skyline like Houston does. And judging your proficiency, man. Wally, I'm a 52 year old man who has a big ego. I don't like to judge myself. I just think I'm the best in the world and it's hard for me to reflect on should I or shouldn't I go? It's a tough decision.
19:56
Wally Mulhern
Right, right. And most of the time in a scenario like that, most of the time the flight is not a, hey, we need to go tonight. It's hey, let's go do this, you know, let's go for a flight next week or something. Like that. So you really have the opportunity most likely to go out and get some proficiency going.
20:19
Bobby Doss
Well, I do own a flight school and I have plenty of people around. Man, I, I probably fly with an instructor at least a couple of hours before any big trip. I just want to be pushed. I want my proficiency to be there. I do not want to be my worst at my day. I want to be my best on my worst day. And I can't be that if I haven't done a forward slip in six months. I can't do that if I haven't had any partial panel work. I need all of that to be the best that it can be, or I'm just not going to be there. Right?
20:53
Wally Mulhern
Yeah.
20:54
Bobby Doss
Let's jump to part two, Tools for better decision making. You know, there's a few acronyms we use. I think everyone knows Pavement. I think decide is another good acronym that we can use. How many applicants post checkride day, Wally, do you think really sit down with a sheet of paper and kind of write out pave?
21:20
Wally Mulhern
Probably not many at all. And you know, I will say this at my airline, at United Airlines, every flight starts with a. Well, you know, we breathe in a flight planning area, but we get to the airplane and we do a, a briefing where we actually, you know, brief the actual takeoff that we're about to do. But the first part of it is we talk about threats and the first thing on the threats part of our briefing is personal. How's everybody doing? Did you know, you sleep well last night? If it's a red eye, did you get a good nap today? You know, just how's everybody doing? And then we talk about the technical aspect of things. How's the airplane? Do we have anything that's inoperative on the airplane? How's the airport? You know, are all the lighting working?
22:20
Wally Mulhern
And then we talk about environmental. You know, hey, we got mountains out there, we got weather, we got this. So every one of our takeoffs, every one of our flights, I should say, starts with that. And that's basically pave.
22:35
Bobby Doss
Yeah. I think the key is, is that. And I've seen one of your. Well, I've seen a co worker of yours has a, on his ID badge. On the back of it is kind of like these. I don't know how many bullets, maybe six bullets. But I have seen this very thing. I have a picture of this very thing. Right. And yeah, anyone who doesn't go through it is not apply. Not applying the regulations. I Mean, pre flight actions is required. I mean, right, you get ramp checked and you don't have a weight balance, you're in trouble. No question asked, right?
23:05
Wally Mulhern
Yeah.
23:05
Bobby Doss
But the most important thing is are you fit to fly? Are you ready to go? Do you the pilot, you, the airplane, you, the environment, you, the external pressures, that is pave. And I just can't stress enough that it's critical that you make those decisions because we are so dependent on our instructor doing that for us early on. Again, if you're listening to this episode and you're a 4000 hour pilot, maybe you are good at all this, but we're Talking to the 60 to 90 hour graduate of a private program. If you're not doing something to make these decisions every time you go, you're taking risks that you shouldn't be taking, they might ultimately Swiss cheese you into a really, really bad spot.
23:50
Wally Mulhern
Yeah, next time. Oh, going back to that we, you know, at again at United Airlines, we beginning four hours before our scheduled departure time, when we open up our EFP, our iPad, we have to click on something that we have to declare fit for duty. We have to say, we have to click on this thing and say, yep, I'm ready to go. And you know, are there times that you forget? Yeah, there are. And you know, it might be 45 minutes before departure, you'll get a message from our dispatch that says, hey, the captain or the first officer has not declared fit for duty. And then, oh yeah, okay, sorry about that. And you go on and take care of it. But it is a physical thing. I mean we have to click that button.
24:37
Wally Mulhern
It's kind of like agreeing to terms and service like you do on, you know, you go to a lot of websites.
24:43
Bobby Doss
The other thing I think under the tools for better decision making is that an instructor for so long has been the person that has had the what if mindset. Like what if we're on the go and we have a flat tire? What if we are in the pattern and we have some catastrophic failure with the engine? What if, what if, what if? How do you, as a young pilot, I'm asking the audience, what are you doing to have the what if scenario? I had a great vision jet trip last week to Colorado. Love that damn plane. Have a ton of fun flying it.
25:21
Bobby Doss
But it's one of those things that I have a better emergency briefing in the vision jet with a second pilot who's helping me be proficient and good than I probably do when my wife's next to Me in the top hawk, right, because she's not a pilot, she's not going to do much. I have it in my own brain. But man, when we're in that vision jet, my briefing in the vision jet is something like this. I say, look, if we're on the ground, we're going to abort. If anything happens, I hear a noise, anything, I'm going to abort. The wheels come off the ground, plenty of Runway remaining. We're going to land right in front of us the second we put the gear up. If we're out of Runway, we're going to be committed.
26:01
Bobby Doss
If there's still Runway, I'm going to put the gear down, land right in front of us. Once we're out of Runway, I'm looking for 600ft AGL so I can call out capsule. Caps is available. Caps being the parachute at 600ft. We have that as an option. We're going to continue to climb and go straight Forward at above 1500ft. We're going to talk about it if we have an emergency. But I am going to declare an emergency under any of these circumstances and I'm going to declare you pilot in command. I don't have the number of hours the guy next to me has. He's going to better than me. She's going to better than me if she's a female and I shouldn't be piloting command. But we talk about it before we even get to the whole short line.
26:39
Bobby Doss
That conversation's been had and it's in my brain. And when we're on the go, we have, we know what we're going to do at on the ground, we know we're going to do it one foot. We know we're going to do it 500ft, we know we're going to do it 600ft and above 600ft, but we're going no matter what. And I don't do that, probably as rigorous with other people in the plane that aren't pilots. But if you're not thinking about it as a single engine, single pilot operations, you're crazy. Because any of those things could happen. You might not have a parachute, but you need to know what you're gonna do. And I think Pat, who's been on this show a few times, hates the mindset of at a thousand feet, I'm turning back, man. It's not always the best decision.
27:23
Bobby Doss
Now, at a thousand feet in a Cessna, do you have options? Yes, but turning back's not always gonna be realistic. I might Turn right. Cause there's a golf course, I might turn left because there's a forest to my right and there's a field to my left. Right. But think about it, say it to yourself, talk it out loud. Because I can assure your instructor's been doing it every time that you've taken off and you didn't know it. So the what if the scenario based stuff is super important. And the third part of this section, Tools for better decision making is how do you use tech and how do you use the tech wisely? I'm sure you have a million stories, Wally.
28:06
Bobby Doss
I wanted to tee it up without laughing, but how many times has the GPS or the technology in the airplane caused the failure? Not the pilot?
28:18
Wally Mulhern
A lot. A lot. You know, is your heart broke for.
28:22
Bobby Doss
Those people that you just said?
28:23
Wally Mulhern
It is, it is. And you know where it is really frustrating is somebody's coming in to get a multi engine rating and maybe they're not extremely familiar with the avionics in this particular multi engine airplane and they go out and they actually do the multi engine stuff fairly well. And we come in for the instrument approach, which is going to be a single engine approach by the way. We all know that. But. And they can't set the approach up using the equipment in the airplane. You know, it's unsat and. But it's kind of a, maybe not a multi engine thing more so than it is using the equipment in the airplane thing.
29:18
Bobby Doss
Yeah. And it just goes back to so many other episodes, so many other things. You gotta know it and think of the real world scenario where there could be a problem single engine. If you don't know how to do that and you're in the clouds, assuming this is an instrument rated applicant, they're getting a multi engine rating and then they're going to want to go time build. They might have someone who has one less hour than them next to them in a different multi engine aircraft. Like man, what a bad day that would be. What a bad day. So use tech wisely. If you don't know the tech, practice it. There's plenty of simulators out there's plenty of other things you can use. Make sure the tech isn't what gets you.
30:01
Wally Mulhern
Yeah. And another thing that I see a lot and way too often, you know, most of the airplanes that we're flying are hundred knot airplanes and they burn about 10 gallons an hour. So you know, I ask my applicant how far, how you know, what's the distance to where we're going say 260 miles. So right off the bat, 260 divided by 100 is 2.6 and that's 2 hours and 36 minutes. I'll ask them what their flight time is. I'll say hour 41. Wow. Okay. How much fuel are we going to burn? 20. 24.8. Okay, well. And in my mind I'm thinking, well, the 24.8 makes sense for the 260 miles, but the hour 41 or whatever I said doesn't make sense, you know, so you gotta check for reasonableness. You know, if it smells like fish, it probably is fish.
31:10
Wally Mulhern
So you know, and I will say to them, I'll say, wow, hour 41. We must have a really good talent. Well, that's what foreflight gave me. Well, okay, all right.
31:25
Bobby Doss
Is that really by the foreflight bug? Yeah, it's a real risk and it's a real problem I think nowadays because we have become so dependent on those things and we don't know that how bad the data in data out really is in that scenario for sure.
31:41
Wally Mulhern
Yeah.
31:42
Bobby Doss
Jumping to part three. Learning from real incidents and stories. Hopefully you've listened to the Paul Craig episodes. Hopefully you've listened to the Killing Zone. And if you aren't a fan, you're crazy. It's good material. At the end of the day, let's tell a few good stories. Wally, where have you seen whether it was your daughters, whether it was other pilots, whether it was applicants? Where have you seen good decision making? Like today you were pro, I think you were scheduled to be a UFS all day and you didn't do any check rides. Were there any. Was, were any of those decisions horrible decisions?
32:20
Wally Mulhern
No, they're great decisions.
32:21
Bobby Doss
And it was a clear day though, Wally. It was crystal clear. It was clear to 10 million. Why didn't you fly?
32:27
Wally Mulhern
Yeah, well, it was real clear because that air was up there moving around and it was moving really fast. I've got a down fence in my backyard to prove, prove that. Yeah. You know, and both the applicants, you know, we communicated obviously. And it was two multi engine rides, so they were more advanced and I wouldn't have done a checkride in today's wins. A training flight maybe, but certainly not a checkride.
33:05
Bobby Doss
And look, I know both these people, I'm close with both these people, you know, how bad they wanted to go, I mean mentally, how bad they want this to get over with, how hard they've worked to achieve this. And they made all the right decisions because it's not a good day to go. And it wasn't an easy decision. External pressures, bang, bang, get this done. You know, you've flown in this before, you can do it. Bang, bang, go. But, man, really good decisions. What about. Have you ever. I guess this is, I'm thinking this real time, so forgive me if it catches you off guard.
33:46
Bobby Doss
Have you ever got into a plane to let this person make their own decision and thought, if he tries to rotate, I'm not letting him rotate or her rotate because it was so windy, the weather was so bad around you whatever.
34:02
Wally Mulhern
Yeah, no, I, I, I don't recall ever doing that. I do recall an applicant taking off with a pitot tube cover on, and we, we took off and it was pretty good.
34:19
Bobby Doss
What was your air speed?
34:21
Wally Mulhern
It was, it was zero. It was zero. And he called it, he said, hey, airspeed's not working. And next thing I know, we're flying. And I kind of went, wow, okay. Well, that's very interesting. We did have an airplane that had a gps, so we had ground speed. But, you know, as you know, of course, the checkride was immediately unsatisfactory. But I did point out to them that we can look at our ground speed now and then look at our ground speed on downwind, and kind of do some mental math and kind of figure out, you know, if we have any winds or anything. But, yeah, I mean, that was, that was a poor decision.
35:09
Bobby Doss
So real incidents are going to happen. From my stories about seat belts hanging out of the door, to anything you can possibly imagine, from losing a cylinder to having carbide to anything else. You have to understand that these incidents, maybe small, maybe big, are going to happen. One story I tell, and I don't think I've told him much on this one, the podcast, but I was on my third or fourth solo, really close to getting done, and the shimmy dampener, which is a small little cylinder on a Cessna that kind of keeps the front wheel centered, had clearly seen its life expectancy. And as I pushed the throttle in full, the front wheel was wobbling. If you've ever seen a motorcycle have the wobbles or anything like that.
36:02
Bobby Doss
And it wanted the plane to go left, which in this scenario, in this time frame, were on the, I was on the small Runway all by myself, and it was going right towards the water, Wally. And I thought, oh, my gosh, I cannot. I gotta abort. And I aborted. And I thought I made the best decision ever. And I came back and my wife's like, oh, my God, you can't fly anymore. This is too dangerous. And I said, no, each of these incidents are making me better. These are not huge, catastrophic things. But what do you think as a pilot now? Back pressure means so much more to me than it did prior to the wobbles on that flight. A little bit of more back pressure still shouldn't have gone without a shimmy dampener that was working correctly.
36:51
Bobby Doss
But a little bit of back pressure takes all that weight off that wheel and takes the shimmy out of it.
36:57
Wally Mulhern
Right.
36:58
Bobby Doss
I wouldn't have known that had I had not had this problem. And someone taught me that you have to experience some of these things. Don't go out there and try and make them happen. But, man, each of these little real world incidents, everything you experience as a pilot by yourself will make you a better pilot.
37:16
Wally Mulhern
Yeah. I remember flying a twin Cessna. I don't remember what version it was. A 414, I think, and taking off. And right as we took off, I heard a, a big pop. Literally heard a pop. And of course, I'm looking at engine instruments and everything's fine. The airplane's flying just fine. And so I continued. The guy was trying to sell the airplane and I flew it about 100 miles away. I put the gear down, I went in and landed. And as soon as that nose wheel touched down, I figured out what it was. We'd flown a nose wheel tire on takeoff. And they tell me that you're more likely to blow a tire on takeoff than you are on landing.
38:03
Bobby Doss
Interesting.
38:04
Wally Mulhern
Yeah. And now hindsight being 20, first of all, I would not have raised the gear and I wouldn't have continued. I would have come around to my home airport. Luckily, they had maintenance at the other airport and they had a tire and we had the airplane fixed and no time, really, it wasn't an issue at all. But, you know, I had someone, a young man on a check ride the other day. We, we did a landing, I think it was a short field landing. And he put it down and he thought it was a very hard landing. It wasn't. I mean, I've been in a lot worse. But he said, oh, we need to go check. I think I blew the nose tire and I, I, I let him, you know, went and we checked, we shut the airplane down.
38:52
Wally Mulhern
He got out and looked at it and came back and he said, well, no, I obviously didn't blow it. And I told him, I said, look, if you blow a nose tire, there is no question. I mean, that airplane, I mean, you know it, you know, you can't steer.
39:06
Bobby Doss
It, you can't move it. It's tough.
39:08
Wally Mulhern
Probably if you're thinking that I blow a nose tire, you probably didn't. But he did the same thing. He went and checked it out and we finished the checkride and it was a satisfactory outcome.
39:20
Bobby Doss
Awesome. Well, hopefully all of you are successful on your next checkride. Hopefully. If you're a private student and you're about to take that check ride, you have big plans to do fun things with your flying capabilities beyond just starting your instrument rating. You'll get the chance to meet Wally at some point in the future for your instrument, no matter what. But go do some real world flying. Go learn how to make the judgments and the decisions that you need to make to be a better pilot. We talked about decision points, we talked about better decision making and we talked about real incidents and real stories today that will make you a better pilot. Experience is what you need and experience will make you a great pilot. As always, thanks for listening and stay behind the prop.
40:05
Nick Alan
Thanks for checking out the behind the Prop podcast. Be sure to click subscribe and check us out online@bravetheprop.com behind the Prop is recorded in Houston, Texas. Creator and host is Bobby Dossier. Co host is Wally Mulhern. The show is for entertainment purposes only and is not meant to replace actual flight instruction. Thanks for listening and remember, fly safe.